Author Topic: What's a good kicker motor?  (Read 5243 times)

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Seattleflyfisher

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What's a good kicker motor?
« on: November 07, 2013, 05:36:04 AM »
Any news on new kicker motors this year? Fuel injection yet? Why is your kicker motor good? I need to buy one and I'm open to ideas!



SFF

Online Markshoreline

Re: What's a good kicker motor?
« Reply #1 on: November 07, 2013, 07:31:12 AM »
I'd love to have one with EFI but I don't know of any manufacturer who produces 10 hp and below with that feature yet...
2002 Sea Ranger HT 21, Yamaha 150, Yamaha 9.9

Offline Threeweight

Re: What's a good kicker motor?
« Reply #2 on: November 07, 2013, 10:41:16 AM »
Suzuki has fuel injected 15 and 20 hp motors on the market now that don't weigh much (108# in the manual tilt model).  I haven't looked into them lately, but they were getting rave reviews last year.  At the boat shows last winter the dealers did not yet have a power tilt/trim version of it in a long shaft.  They did say it will take the hi-thrust props used in their 9.9 hp kickers (but they didn't know of any plans to offer a low-geared kicker model).

I read recently that Tohatsu now has a fuel injected 15 hp model as well, but it is a little heavier than the Suzi.  That tells me it won't be long before we see a Mercury 15 "Bigfoot" with fuel injection. 

The Yammie T9.9 is still the gold standard.
Former Sea Chaser 17 owner
Wild Card, Hewescraft Ocean Pro 220, Honda 225 and 9.9

“Never turn your back on fear. It should always be in front of you, like a thing that might have to be killed.”
       --- Hunter S. Thompson

Offline First Cabin

Re: What's a good kicker motor?
« Reply #3 on: November 07, 2013, 11:06:53 PM »
Any news on new kicker motors this year? Fuel injection yet? Why is your kicker motor good? I need to buy one and I'm open to ideas!



SFF

I had a Johnson POS.  Went to a F8 Yamaha.  Put a million hours on it.  Never a hiccup.  Changed over to a F6 Yamaha(older 2 cylinder model) on next boat.    Never a hiccup.  Current boat has a T8.  Never a hiccup.  Electric start and tilt is fantastic.  Three great kickers....  I'm sold.

Why would you buy anything other than a Yamaha T9.9?   :shrug9:
First:  1982 15' SeaHunter, Yamaha 70 2-stroke, Yamaha F6
Second:  1987 17' SeaRanger, Merc 90 2-stroke, Yamaha F8
Current:  2002 17' SeaChaser, Yamaha F100, Yamaha T8

Seattleflyfisher

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Re: What's a good kicker motor?
« Reply #4 on: November 08, 2013, 04:45:13 AM »
A few years ago I answered an ad on Craigslist from a guy in Vancouver Wa. He had a T8. Lets say it had a few issues. Well the story goes on.....I decided to split the differance and meet him in chehalis at Bergerville at 9:30pm. So, I had to park by a light pole just to see the motor. This motor was in bad shape. It had a few things broken off. I can't really remember exactly what the parts were now but after getting the motor home and the spending the next 2 months buying parts from iboats.com and putting it together that motor was awesome. It was electric start and electic tilt. It had all of the bells and whistles! I think I had it about 6 months and decided to change my main over to a 4 stroke 90 Honda. So...me being stupid I changed the kicker to match the main. That motor was sold to a river guide guy up north somewhere in the Bellingham area.

I end this story by saying I cry every time I think about matching motor manufactures just to be cool. Sure they looked good but the Honda kicker was a pile of poop. So now I have 40 hours on my main Yahama. I must decide the kicker that will go next to it. So far I have not read one post that says Yamaha kickers are bad here. I sure was hoping to get a 9.9 or a 8hp with EFI this year but that does not look like it will happen.

So......if the river guide guy is on this site. I have one question for you!  Brotha.....please sell me that motor back at a decent price :shrug9:


SFF
« Last Edit: November 08, 2013, 04:48:48 AM by Seattleflyfisher »

Offline CoolBreeze

Re: What's a good kicker motor?
« Reply #5 on: November 08, 2013, 05:53:20 AM »
As weight is an issue for a kicker, here are some specs for the top three manufacturers in the 8-9.9 class. (lightest to heaviest):

Yamaha 8 Long Shaft Manual - 85# - No power charging without optional accessory
Yamaha 9.9 Long Shaft Manual - 89#
Yamaha 9.9 Long Shaft Electric Start/Tilt - 93#
Honda 9.9 Long Shaft Manual - 98#
Honda 8 Long Shaft Manual- 98#
Honda 9.9 Long Shaft Electric Start/Trim - 108#

The Mercury site is somewhat misleading in their weights as they only quote the 'lightest model available', which is assuredly a short shaft motor with manual start. For this reason I did not include it above. Here is Mercury's specs:

Mercury 9.9 - Short Shaft - 84#
Mercury 8 Short Shaft 84#
Mercury 9.9 Bigfoot - Short Shaft - 96#

Yamaha appears to win strictly on weight-to-hp ratio. I find it interesting too that the difference in weight between the heaviest 9.9 and the lightest 9.9 is only 19#!  I also should point out that the difference between an electric start Yamaha and a manual 8 is only 8#. Now, if money was no object, it makes more sense to go for the Electric 9.9 than the 8 because of the better thrust, electrical charging standard, and only marginal increase in weight.

How much hp does one really need in a kicker? For a 15-17' boat is 8 hp plenty? I seem to be finding myself on many small boats with 9.9hp motors that only use the first 10% of their available power. Are we being constantly upsold by our dealers into buying more hp than we really need to just troll around fishing?

Can anyone comment on the efficiency of these motors? I'm not sure if it matters, but the Yamaha 9.9 is rated 2 stars, and the Yamaha 8 and Honda 8 and 9.9 are all rated 3 stars. Does more stars mean that the motor is more efficient on fuel?

CB

« Last Edit: November 08, 2013, 06:11:15 AM by CoolBreeze »

Offline Grizzle

Re: What's a good kicker motor?
« Reply #6 on: November 08, 2013, 06:16:17 AM »
Unfortunately those motor weights are not accurate in my experience of having weighed them in the shop. The extra long motor clamps, starter, hydraulic pump, and tilt ramp add 30# to the motors.

Yamaha F8 20 manual tilt and start is 93#
Yamaha t8 20" with electric start and manual tilt is 105#
Yamaha t9.9 with electric tilt trim is ~125#

Comparable BF9.9 are about 10# heavier so 103#, 115#, 135#

The Honda 8 does in fact weight 79lbs - amazing to me
Brook Stockton - My Boat: Mighty Molly - The Fish Monger - Arima SeaChaser 16 - Soft SkipTower and "The Rack"

SALTBOSS™ MARINE - Offshore Marine Products & Fabrication - http://saltbossmarine.com - brook@saltbossmarine.com - 206-953-SALT (7258)

Offline CoolBreeze

Re: What's a good kicker motor?
« Reply #7 on: November 08, 2013, 06:30:48 AM »
I can't say I'm surprised that the weights are heavier than quoted, but I am very surprised to hear that the Honda is lighter. Hmm.

I was checking the Yamaha site and couldn't find the t8. Is that a high thrust version?

CB

Seattleflyfisher

  • Guest
Re: What's a good kicker motor?
« Reply #8 on: November 08, 2013, 06:43:14 AM »
I think the T8 was discontinued. My understanding was t was a very nice motor.



SFF

Offline Grizzle

Re: What's a good kicker motor?
« Reply #9 on: November 08, 2013, 07:00:09 AM »
The 79# Honda is the square top classic.  All the round top Hondas are heavier.

The T8 was discontinued in 2008 +/-.  The T 9.9 is basically the same motor.
Brook Stockton - My Boat: Mighty Molly - The Fish Monger - Arima SeaChaser 16 - Soft SkipTower and "The Rack"

SALTBOSS™ MARINE - Offshore Marine Products & Fabrication - http://saltbossmarine.com - brook@saltbossmarine.com - 206-953-SALT (7258)

Online Peddler

Re: What's a good kicker motor?
« Reply #10 on: November 08, 2013, 08:07:31 AM »
I wouldn't have anything besides my Yamaha T9.9.  Had a, '01 +/- Merc 9.9 Bigfoot on my last boat, and it was fine, never let me down, but the T9.9 is heads and tails better.  Maybe the new Merc "Pro Kickers" are on-par, but I've no experience.

A 6 or 8 would be plenty on a small boat, like a 15-19 ft Arima, but since the smallest "High Thrust" motor from Yamaha is a 9.9, it gets my recommendation.
Wishin' I was Fishin'

Offline Threeweight

Re: What's a good kicker motor?
« Reply #11 on: November 08, 2013, 12:07:10 PM »
The lightweight 80# Honda 8 Griz is referring to is the BF8A, very different design than the newer motors.  It also has a 5 amp charging circuit (but only manual tilt/trim).

That weight list is off on some other motors as well.  For instance, Yamaha lists the T9.9 w/ power tilt, trim, and elec start as 114# on their web site, not 93#.  And remember that the weight typically cited in the advertising is without prop, cables and rigging, oil in the crank case, or any steering linkage.  Factor those in and you are at the 125# Griz mentions.

Most of the other motors will be the same way.  If you have the $$, the Yamaha T9.9 is the way to go right now.  Just remember that on a 17' or smaller Arima, stern weight is an issue and you need to make some allowances for that.
Former Sea Chaser 17 owner
Wild Card, Hewescraft Ocean Pro 220, Honda 225 and 9.9

“Never turn your back on fear. It should always be in front of you, like a thing that might have to be killed.”
       --- Hunter S. Thompson

Online Kimbrey

Re: What's a good kicker motor?
« Reply #12 on: November 08, 2013, 12:36:24 PM »
I have an electric start/electric tilt 9.9 Suzi with about a hour on it sitting in my garage.  Put it on my Trophy then turned around and bought the SL so it didn't get used.  I wouldn't let the Suzi go with the Trophy when I bought the Duck.  Not sure what I'll sell if for.... :biggrin: :biggrin:
2005 Sea Legend --Sold--replaced with 26' Duckworth

Seattleflyfisher

  • Guest
Re: What's a good kicker motor?
« Reply #13 on: November 08, 2013, 01:08:54 PM »
Come on Kim

What happened to pay if forward?, Its like you are trying to keep a Norwegian down :shrug9:





SFF

Online Kimbrey

Re: What's a good kicker motor?
« Reply #14 on: November 08, 2013, 01:15:33 PM »
Come on Kim

What happened to pay if forward?, Its like you are trying to keep a Norwegian down :shrug9:





SFF
Gotta wait till I get home from up North to figure it out anyway.  In theory 7th to the 10th of December.  Could be earlier but we will see.
2005 Sea Legend --Sold--replaced with 26' Duckworth

Online Peddler

Re: What's a good kicker motor?
« Reply #15 on: November 08, 2013, 03:24:35 PM »
In theory 7th to the 10th of December.  Could be earlier but we will see.

Are you driving the boat down or is the other guy?
Wishin' I was Fishin'

Online Kimbrey

Re: What's a good kicker motor?
« Reply #16 on: November 08, 2013, 03:37:13 PM »
In theory 7th to the 10th of December.  Could be earlier but we will see.

Are you driving the boat down or is the other guy?
I'm driving. :nono: :nono:  Yahoooo I love the Gulf this time of year....that's sarcasm.
2005 Sea Legend --Sold--replaced with 26' Duckworth

Online Peddler

Re: What's a good kicker motor?
« Reply #17 on: November 08, 2013, 04:43:45 PM »
In theory 7th to the 10th of December.  Could be earlier but we will see.

Are you driving the boat down or is the other guy?
I'm driving. :nono: :nono:  Yahoooo I love the Gulf this time of year....that's sarcasm.

Kick it up to WOT, let's see what that baby can do!  LOL
Wishin' I was Fishin'

Offline CoolBreeze

Re: What's a good kicker motor?
« Reply #18 on: November 09, 2013, 04:13:44 PM »
It sounds like the consensus is that the Yamaha t9.9 is the best out there, but I'm curious how it would stack up against the Suzuki 15 EFI.  It sounds like the Suzuki1 15EFI would be around the same weight, have all the benefits of EFI, and have more hp.  Yamaha has a much better reputation and following, but does EFI make up the difference? Maybe 15 is way overkill for trolling? Anyone care to comment?

CB

Suzuki has fuel injected 15 and 20 hp motors on the market now that don't weigh much (108# in the manual tilt model).  I haven't looked into them lately, but they were getting rave reviews last year.  At the boat shows last winter the dealers did not yet have a power tilt/trim version of it in a long shaft.  They did say it will take the hi-thrust props used in their 9.9 hp kickers (but they didn't know of any plans to offer a low-geared kicker model).

I read recently that Tohatsu now has a fuel injected 15 hp model as well, but it is a little heavier than the Suzi.  That tells me it won't be long before we see a Mercury 15 "Bigfoot" with fuel injection. 

The Yammie T9.9 is still the gold standard.

Offline Threeweight

Re: What's a good kicker motor?
« Reply #19 on: November 09, 2013, 05:43:44 PM »
EFI is awesome because you have no choke/cold blooded start issues to fiddle with, no carb jets to get plugged up and require cleaning, and fewer issues with ethanol and bad fuel (the fuel rail in an EFI motor is sealed off from the air, so fuel doesn't go bad in it the same way it does sitting in the bowl of a carb).  EFI motors also tend to run quieter and smother, and get better fuel economy.

On the other hand, the Yamaha T9.9 is a purpose-built kicker, and the best engineered one on the market at that.  The Suzi has potential, but the ones I looked at last year were set up more for running a zodiac or skiff up on plane.  I don't know if Suzi has a power tilt and trim model out yet, and I'd want to see if they offered a hotter thermostat for it as well.

There's a good video of one of the new Suzi's running in a tank on Youtube... it seems much smoother and quieter than their older kicker offerings:

http://www.youtube.com/v/t1lZiZedJjk
Former Sea Chaser 17 owner
Wild Card, Hewescraft Ocean Pro 220, Honda 225 and 9.9

“Never turn your back on fear. It should always be in front of you, like a thing that might have to be killed.”
       --- Hunter S. Thompson

Offline CoolBreeze

Re: What's a good kicker motor?
« Reply #20 on: November 09, 2013, 07:36:42 PM »
I don't think there's a power tilt/trim model yet. But it is electric start. What do you mean by a 'hotter thermostat'? I'm unfamiliar with this mod. Is it like chipping the motor's computer?

Offline Grizzle

Re: What's a good kicker motor?
« Reply #21 on: November 09, 2013, 08:07:31 PM »
If you think you might want to do automatic throttle control in the future I would check if any of the top brands support EFI.  Troll Master, Garmin TR-1, etc.
Brook Stockton - My Boat: Mighty Molly - The Fish Monger - Arima SeaChaser 16 - Soft SkipTower and "The Rack"

SALTBOSS™ MARINE - Offshore Marine Products & Fabrication - http://saltbossmarine.com - brook@saltbossmarine.com - 206-953-SALT (7258)

Offline Hydro-Therapy

Re: What's a good kicker motor?
« Reply #22 on: November 09, 2013, 11:32:14 PM »

 As for a 15hp being to much for a kicker. My 19SR came with a yamamerc 15 4 stroke and work out great.  It will idle down enough to catch trout and has plenty of power for good steering control on the Columbia in the currents. As on any of the 4 stroke kickers a troll master is a must.

 H-T
Fish forever Work whenever !!!!!
"89" 19SR Keith 115 Merc. 15 4s kicker W/trollmaster Raymarine A70D

Offline CoolBreeze

Re: What's a good kicker motor?
« Reply #23 on: November 10, 2013, 06:01:12 AM »
Does the Yamaha t9.9 have a tiller arm? That's important for me as I like to sit by the kicker and watch the rods.

Offline StreamFixer

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Re: What's a good kicker motor?
« Reply #24 on: November 10, 2013, 07:17:20 AM »
Nearly all kickers can be ordered with or without the tiller.  Many sail boats need to have no tiller...

Good 15 hp motor with very low hours on consignment at Clatsop Power (Astoria).  Ask for Greg and let him know I referred.

StreamFixer
'97 19SC w/ Salt Boss Top
'03 Yamaha 115 EFI
'05 Yamaha T8 Solas 4 blade prop

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