Author Topic: Amperage draw of starter during starting?  (Read 492 times)

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Offline Svinny88

Amperage draw of starter during starting?
« on: January 31, 2020, 10:52:10 AM »
I’ve been looking everywhere, but cannot find the amperage draw of a Honda BF100.  Does anyone have an idea of a ballpark estimate?  Possibly a max estimate? Im getting ready to order some lithium batteries from relion, and they asked me for starting amperage draw, to decide if their rb 50 hp will have enough cranking amps https://relionbattery.com/products/lithium/rb50-hp
1998 15’11” sea explorer. 2020 Honda bf100
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Online DevMah

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Re: Amperage draw of starter during starting?
« Reply #1 on: January 31, 2020, 01:17:59 PM »
100 to 150 A

My 150 Yammy clamped in was about 150A

Dev
2015 21' Sea Ranger  (Tight lines)
2015 Yamaha F150
2013 Mercury 9.9 Bigfoot 4 blade
2012 Lund 1650SS  w 2012 60HP Mercury-Sold

Offline Svinny88

Re: Amperage draw of starter during starting?
« Reply #2 on: January 31, 2020, 02:31:48 PM »
Thanks dev.  So if the battery has a 200 cca , it should be good?  I do have my batteries up front, running 2ga leads to the back
1998 15’11” sea explorer. 2020 Honda bf100
 “T roLL on 1”

Offline Fisherdv

Re: Amperage draw of starter during starting?
« Reply #3 on: January 31, 2020, 02:41:19 PM »
I believe the owners manual for your new motor will say the minimum (ah) rating it requires.
2018 Sea Chaser 16, Honda 60HP

Online DevMah

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Re: Amperage draw of starter during starting?
« Reply #4 on: January 31, 2020, 03:19:45 PM »
I looked at you battery link ... it has 400 A peak
For a 100 hp outboard you are fine.

Dev
2015 21' Sea Ranger  (Tight lines)
2015 Yamaha F150
2013 Mercury 9.9 Bigfoot 4 blade
2012 Lund 1650SS  w 2012 60HP Mercury-Sold

Offline Svinny88

Re: Amperage draw of starter during starting?
« Reply #5 on: January 31, 2020, 06:35:29 PM »
Ok thanks. Now the way it was described to me, lithium batteries don’t have a cca rating, which is measured over a 30second interval, but only have a peak amp rating, which is for a 3-5 second interval. Is this correct? Also, is there any reason I should keep the agm batteries for start and house, and just go with 3 lithium’s for the tm battery bank?  I’d like to go all lithium, as this will let me lose 125lbs, which is a lot on a 16’ boat
1998 15’11” sea explorer. 2020 Honda bf100
 “T roLL on 1”

Online DevMah

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Re: Amperage draw of starter during starting?
« Reply #6 on: February 01, 2020, 10:11:56 AM »
Ok thanks. Now the way it was described to me, lithium batteries don’t have a cca rating, which is measured over a 30second interval, but only have a peak amp rating, which is for a 3-5 second interval. Is this correct? Also, is there any reason I should keep the agm batteries for start and house, and just go with 3 lithium’s for the tm battery bank?  I’d like to go all lithium, as this will let me lose 125lbs, which is a lot on a 16’ boat

Lithium boat batteries are new and I have only worked with AGM and lead acid... I have a tough enough time telling people about AGM due to the cost. I do know that both AGM and lead acid will have no issue cranking your boat engine.

Dev
2015 21' Sea Ranger  (Tight lines)
2015 Yamaha F150
2013 Mercury 9.9 Bigfoot 4 blade
2012 Lund 1650SS  w 2012 60HP Mercury-Sold

Online croaker stroker

Re: Amperage draw of starter during starting?
« Reply #7 on: February 01, 2020, 10:44:55 AM »
I am remaining skeptical about lithium batteries on boats. 🤔

I know they have improved the technology since 2012, but there was an awful local boat fire recently caused by lithium batteries and that memory is still sticking in my mind.


https://www.boatus.com/seaworthy/magazine/2012/january/hazards.asp



 
« Last Edit: February 01, 2020, 10:50:00 AM by Croaker Stroker »
1987 - 17' Sea Pacer - 2004 Evinrude 90 E-tec
1985 - 15' Sea Sprinter - **SOLD**

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Offline Svinny88

Re: Amperage draw of starter during starting?
« Reply #8 on: February 01, 2020, 02:39:32 PM »
The way it was explained to me, is that lithium ion batteries are still dangerous, but lipo4 are not
1998 15’11” sea explorer. 2020 Honda bf100
 “T roLL on 1”

Offline Svinny88

Re: Amperage draw of starter during starting?
« Reply #9 on: February 02, 2020, 06:05:54 AM »
Lithium Iron Phosphate (LiFePO4)

Phosphate based technology possesses superior thermal and chemical stability which provides better safety characteristics than those of Lithium-ion technology made with other cathode materials. Lithium phosphate cells are incombustible in the event of mishandling during charge or discharge, they are more stable under overcharge or short circuit conditions and they can withstand high temperatures without decomposing. When abuse does occur, the phosphate based cathode material will not burn and is not prone to thermal runaway. Phosphate chemistry also offers a longer cycle life.

Copied this from this website...pretty decent read on different types of lithium batteries
1998 15’11” sea explorer. 2020 Honda bf100
 “T roLL on 1”

Offline darci

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Re: Amperage draw of starter during starting?
« Reply #10 on: April 01, 2020, 09:59:20 AM »
Good info. New Q. What amp size on the post buss fuse? 100,150 or 200 amp ? on my old 90 2 stroke Yamaha I had a 60 amp fuse as recommended by the kid at the counter!
It worked just fine until it did not (maybe 20 starts) then I sold that motor so have been trusting the (10 amp) fuse in the E-tec under the hood.

Offline Svinny88

Re: Amperage draw of starter during starting?
« Reply #11 on: April 02, 2020, 09:26:46 AM »
I’m almost positive that I went with a 150, and have not had any issues
1998 15’11” sea explorer. 2020 Honda bf100
 “T roLL on 1”

Offline Svinny88

Re: Amperage draw of starter during starting?
« Reply #12 on: April 02, 2020, 09:28:56 AM »
Double checked, it is a 200 amp buss at the battery post
1998 15’11” sea explorer. 2020 Honda bf100
 “T roLL on 1”

Offline digitalfella

Re: Amperage draw of starter during starting?
« Reply #13 on: April 02, 2020, 10:55:43 AM »
I have to confess I know not much about newer technology batteries as I have been out of the business that long.  AGMs were still pretty sketchy back in the early 2000's, greta if they worked, but there were too many field failures for my taste.   Obviously things have progressed a lot since then.  But my comments here are about conventional lead acid wet cells.  In another posting on this board, I have seen batteries out in the open, secured yes, but without an enclosure.  No doubt this was to save the space required by a box.   I have never persoanally seen a battery explode, but have repaired the aftermath of several explosions and it isn't a pretty site.  Think hand grenade except it spews acid instead of shrapnel.  We are talking first class nasty.  Seems to me that ALL batteries deserve a secure box to help contain things in the event of disaster.  Having seen video of several LiIon batteries catching fire, they seem more hazardous than lead acid types by a huge factor.  Airlines have pretty strict restrictions for that reason.   Saving the weight of conventional batteries is a real consideration on a small boat, but dang, after you see someones phone catch fire in their hand; well it gives me pause.

I would always give customers this advice about electrical upgrades:  keep it simple, keep it robust, and well executed.  I confess to being a Luddite on this.

DF
1982 Sea Chaser 17', 75hp Honda, 8hp Honda
Retired boat repair guy, located in Anacortes, WA.

Online B-TownRanger

Re: Amperage draw of starter during starting?
« Reply #14 on: April 02, 2020, 11:32:34 AM »
A bit of a rat hole, but since it's being discussed, I thought I would throw in my .02, since I've done some research on this recently. The LifePO batteries are a different technology that Lithium Ion and are supposed to be safer. They are starting to be used much more in Marine situations. A few advantage are:
  • They are modular, so you can build/shape a battery in any way you want. Doesn't have to be a typical cube.
  • They can discharge down much lower that AGM or LA batteries
  • Lighter weight
  • Much longer lifespan, theoretically. Even at their current high price, I think the number of charge/discharge cycles makes they a cheaper option in the long run

That said, there are still some issues. Price is ~$900 for a properly built and balanced battery. Some cheaper, but I'd be weary. They do require some quality electronics to keep the cells balanced and cared for. These are built into the better batteries. Cheap ones won't have the BMS (battery management system) built in. They may not be compatible with some equipment. For example, I can't use them with my Blue Sea ACR, because the ACR trigger voltages are generally too low for lithium batteries. Blue Sea is working on this, but it might require new ACR (mine is the expensive one with built in charger  :doh:). I have enough boat projects in the works that I pretty quickly abandoned the idea of using LifePO4 for my boat at this time. I'll keep dreaming about the solar panels on top of my skip top, charging my lightweight lithium batteries.
1989 Sea Ranger 19 - 2004 BF150 Honda

 

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