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E10 Fuel Question

Started by JamesB, October 19, 2018, 08:10:12 AM

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JamesB

I used E10 Ethanol fuel over the summer months because non ethanol fuel is difficult to find where I live and when I can find it there is a significant premium on the price.  I've asked mechanics and get mixed responses... some say that E10 fuel with the ethanol content will corrode metals, break down rubber components faster, separate when it absorbs water etc.... Other mechanics say that newer outboards have been designed to be compatible with E10 fuels since the majority of fuels available have ethanol in it.  Even the owners manual for outboards state that their engines will work with E10.  At the beginning of September this year, I replaced my water/fuel separating filter and emptied the contents into a glass jar.  Did not see any evidence of water.

So my question is, if I live in the Pacific NorthWest(Canada side), would there be any differences in the winter months(I know that winter months with colder air temps hold less moisture in the air etc), that would create a situation that I would end up getting water in my fuel tank if I had E10 Fuel topped up to the top of the tank?  Was hoping to get some feedback from folks here who have stored their boats outside in the pacific northwest over the winter with E10 Fuel(of course with fuel stabilizer in tank and throughout fuel lines) and whether there was any issues with water in their fuel tank.   

Would blocking the air vent to the tank over the winter months help prevent moisture from entering the tank?  As I understand it, condensate happens when warm air cools down...  the air is warmer during the day and gets colder over night.  My thought is that blocking the air vent would limit the exchange of outside air.  Don't know if that would make any difference. 

Peddler

My understanding is the majority of problems occur on older engines, as fuel system components weren't intended to withstand the ethanol, they'll fail from the inside-out. Also if switching from a long history of using E0 to E10, as the detergent aspect of ethanol will loosen deposits in the fuel system, potentially.

I'd believe that E10 fuel, with a proper dosage of fuel stabilizer should be fine thru the Winter months. I subscribe to the theory that it's better the store a FULL tank, rather than partial, leaving less air for expansion/contraction.

I'd fill the tank, add stabilizer, run the engine for a few minutes to get the stabilizer thru the system, and call it. good.

Personally, I've found the price and inconvenience of buying E0 to be worthwhile, especially in small-engines, such as yard equipment. Even in my 2004 Ford Explorer that's supposed to be "Flex Fuel" compatible, the fuel efficiency of running E0 negates the extra cost, and the throttle response is noticeably better with E0. I'm fortunate to have a station with three grades of E0 fuel, somewhat nearby.


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Wishin' I was Fishin'

Fisherdv

#2
The problem with blocking off the vent completely is that pressure will build up causing your tank to swell in temperature changes and potentially blowing seals. I've seen what happens with the new, EPA approved, non-vented plastic tanks. They swell up like a balloon! I would do as mentioned and just use a fuel stabilizer and keep the tank full
2018 Sea Chaser 16, Honda BFP60

bdaws

All I run in my Honda is non ethanol treated with blue marine Stabil. You should be ok with ethanol as long as it's treated over winter but personally I don't touch E10 unless it's in my daily driver truck that is always getting burned up.

La-Z-Buoy

Agree with Peddler, although if you have a fuel filter/water separator it will take a little longer than a few minutes to flush treated fuel into the motor. I usually treat, fill, and then go on my last fishing trip of the season. Gets treated fuel through everything.
Richard

2001 21' Sea Ranger HT
2017 DF 140 Suzuki, Honda 8

JamesB

based on the replies, I assume everyone used E10 fuel and stabilizer for winter storage, correct?

First Cabin

Water from condensation is not a concern for a number of reasons:  tank is small, tank is plastic, temperature changes are relatively small, air exchange from vent is minute, ...... it's just not ever going to accumulate to enough to cause an issue.  Don't worry about your vent.  If you have water in your fuel system, you've got a leak somewhere.  Is your boat covered?  Be sure and check your fuel cap o-ring!

E10 does degrade though so you should put in an additives others suggest.  I'm fortunate to have E0 available so I don't use any additives.  I just start and run my motors every few weeks all winter.
First:  1982 15' SeaHunter, Yamaha 70 2-stroke, Yamaha F6
Second:  1987 17' SeaRanger, Merc 90 2-stroke, Yamaha F8
Current:  2002 17' SeaChaser, Yamaha F100, Yamaha T8

GregE

Peddler, what station has 3 octanes E0?

Kamilche has 'regular' E0 for $.40 more
Greg
2005 SL 22 Honda 225 Kodak II
http://www.sagecreekforums.com/phpforum/index.php
Sold:Osprey 26 LC Kodak;  Arima SR 19 HT, Arima SE 16 WeeBait; SH 15 WeeBoat; SR 21 NoBait;  SL 22 ReBait

Fisherdv

Quote from: JamesB on October 19, 2018, 05:18:33 PM
based on the replies, I assume everyone used E10 fuel and stabilizer for winter storage, correct?
I don't even think E0 fuel is available anywhere in California.  I put fuel stabilizer at every fill up. That way if I unexpectedly don't use the boat for a while it's already in there
2018 Sea Chaser 16, Honda BFP60

La-Z-Buoy

James, I use E0 and Startron.
Richard

2001 21' Sea Ranger HT
2017 DF 140 Suzuki, Honda 8

Peddler

Quote from: GregE on October 19, 2018, 05:30:49 PM
Peddler, what station has 3 octanes E0?

Kamilche has 'regular' E0 for $.40 more

The Acme Fast Fuel near the Swantown Marina in Olympia.


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croaker stroker

Quote from: Fisherdv on October 19, 2018, 05:46:49 PM
Quote from: JamesB on October 19, 2018, 05:18:33 PM
based on the replies, I assume everyone used E10 fuel and stabilizer for winter storage, correct?
I don't even think E0 fuel is available anywhere in California.  I put fuel stabilizer at every fill up. That way if I unexpectedly don't use the boat for a while it's already in there

I do that. And I winterize my motor during our two weeks of winter-like weather.   :whistle:
1987 - 17' Sea Pacer - 2004 Evinrude 90 E-tec
1985 - 15' Sea Sprinter - **SOLD**

"Ex Tridente Pax". 🇺🇸

Tom Mac

I do nothing, sometimes I get E 0 the rest of the time just regular at the pump. I have not had a problem yet and I have been doing this for years. Odd eh.
1991 Sea Ranger 17, 2014 F90 Yamaha, 2008 T8 Yamaha

Yachter Yat

    I always keep my fuel vent taped.  I've never noticed any expansion......even with half (or sometimes less) fuel.  When stored over long periods, I'd suggest keeping your tank close to full. If expansion is your concern, then I'm sure that would help minimize the potential of that happening.  BTW,  I also never see water, and am thoroughly convinced keeping the air out is one of the reasons why. 


Yat
History is not the past; it's the present, as we all carry it with us......James Baldwin    
16 SC/Honda 60  (sold)

Arimadrifter

What DV said in the 3rd post. That problem left me dead in the water this summer and it won't happen again. As much of a hassle as it is, I still run E0 for piece of mind.
17' Arima SC with 2017 90hp Yamaha

waldocod

I was really worried about running E10 all summer while  in Alaska. Turns out all the fuel in Homer was Ethanol free, both on land and the fuel dock. I was happy to see the fuel dock price was $3.56/gal which is cheaper than I can get it for here from land based gas stations! Right before we came back to Washington, we filled the tank and put in a bottle of blue Stabil and ran one more trip. So at least I have a full tank to start my season here!
2002 Sea Legend HT "Crazy Carol"