Author Topic: 12v guage  (Read 556 times)

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12v guage
« on: September 15, 2018, 05:55:13 PM »
Curious, would voltage from the switch (combine a battery) be different than the voltage from the fuse block?  I ask because both of my sonar's (lowrance/garmin) will typically show a different voltage than the voltage gauge that's wired direct to the switch.  Also typically this gauge will show lower voltage than the sonar....

Doing some rewiring and wondering if the gauge should be wired to the fuse block instead?
SR 17 in Vancouver, BC

Offline DevMah

Re: 12v guage
« Reply #1 on: September 15, 2018, 07:14:16 PM »
Have you confirmed the voltages with a meter?
This will tell you if  the read voltage is correct and you have voltage drop or all of your devices have some calibration differences.


Dev
2015 21' Sea Ranger
2015 Yamaha F150
2013 Mercury 9.9 Bigfoot 4 blade
2012 Lund 1650SS  w 2012 60HP Mercury-Sold

Re: 12v guage
« Reply #2 on: September 15, 2018, 07:41:50 PM »
Have you confirmed the voltages with a meter?
This will tell you if  the read voltage is correct and you have voltage drop or all of your devices have some calibration differences.


Dev

You are the man!! Can't tell you how many of your posts have helped me!  I owe you some serious beers!  I'll do the meter test in the next couple of days.  Another question, out with a (very experienced) friend last week that said I should wire the bilge direct to the battery.  I've read many posts here about that debate, but wonder what you think and how exactly would it be wired?  Ideally I'd still.like the ability to flip the switch when I want as well.
SR 17 in Vancouver, BC

Offline DevMah

Re: 12v guage
« Reply #3 on: September 15, 2018, 08:04:33 PM »
Yes you can do this and add a switch to toggle/control on/ off/ auto.

 Please see Transport Canada regs for small vessels. Section 8 is electrical.


https://www.tc.gc.ca/eng/marinesafety/tp-tp1332-menu-521.htm#wb113



8.6.2 Battery Disconnect Switch

8.6.2.1 A battery disconnect switch shall be installed in the positive conductor from each battery or group of batteries, with a cold cranking average rating greater than 800 amperes, except for small vessels less than 8.0 m (26 ft 3 in) in length.

8.6.2.2 The following devices may be connected to the battery side of the battery switch described in paragraph 8.6.2.1; however, each device shall be provided with circuit protection in accordance with section 8.9:

electronic equipment with continuously powered memory;
safety equipment such as bilge pumps, alarms, carbon monoxide (CO) detectors, and bilge blowers;
battery charging equipment.
8.6.2.3 Battery switches shall be placed in a readily accessible location as close as practicable to the battery, or batteries.

8.6.2.4 Battery disconnect switches shall be capable of carrying the maximum current of the distribution system including the intermittent load of the starter motor circuit.

8.6.2.5 Remote controlled battery disconnect switches, if used, shall also permit safe manual operation at the switch.



Dev
2015 21' Sea Ranger
2015 Yamaha F150
2013 Mercury 9.9 Bigfoot 4 blade
2012 Lund 1650SS  w 2012 60HP Mercury-Sold

Re: 12v guage
« Reply #4 on: September 15, 2018, 08:16:36 PM »
Yes you can do this and add a switch to toggle/control on/ off/ auto.

 Please see Transport Canada regs for small vessels. Section 8 is electrical.


https://www.tc.gc.ca/eng/marinesafety/tp-tp1332-menu-521.htm#wb113



8.6.2 Battery Disconnect Switch

8.6.2.1 A battery disconnect switch shall be installed in the positive conductor from each battery or group of batteries, with a cold cranking average rating greater than 800 amperes, except for small vessels less than 8.0 m (26 ft 3 in) in length.

8.6.2.2 The following devices may be connected to the battery side of the battery switch described in paragraph 8.6.2.1; however, each device shall be provided with circuit protection in accordance with section 8.9:

electronic equipment with continuously powered memory;
safety equipment such as bilge pumps, alarms, carbon monoxide (CO) detectors, and bilge blowers;
battery charging equipment.
8.6.2.3 Battery switches shall be placed in a readily accessible location as close as practicable to the battery, or batteries.

8.6.2.4 Battery disconnect switches shall be capable of carrying the maximum current of the distribution system including the intermittent load of the starter motor circuit.

8.6.2.5 Remote controlled battery disconnect switches, if used, shall also permit safe manual operation at the switch.



Dev

Man, you know far too much ;).
SR 17 in Vancouver, BC

Offline jamaica

Re: 12v guage
« Reply #5 on: September 16, 2018, 10:43:53 AM »
My 12v gauge only reads when the main is on. Wouldn't it be better to have it wired to a battery lead, to a fuse block or wherever that is hot when the battery switch is on, than only read when the main is running?
1994 19' Sea Ranger 150hp Merc 2stk 9.9hp Yam

Offline DevMah

Re: 12v guage
« Reply #6 on: September 17, 2018, 06:53:23 AM »
My 12v gauge only reads when the main is on. Wouldn't it be better to have it wired to a battery lead, to a fuse block or wherever that is hot when the battery switch is on, than only read when the main is running?


From reading the first post he has the gauge at the switch in combine position and the other voltages are shown after the switch on the fuse block feeding the chart plotter/ fish finders.


Dev
2015 21' Sea Ranger
2015 Yamaha F150
2013 Mercury 9.9 Bigfoot 4 blade
2012 Lund 1650SS  w 2012 60HP Mercury-Sold

Re: 12v guage
« Reply #7 on: September 17, 2018, 07:28:05 AM »
My 12v gauge only reads when the main is on. Wouldn't it be better to have it wired to a battery lead, to a fuse block or wherever that is hot when the battery switch is on, than only read when the main is running?


From reading the first post he has the gauge at the switch in combine position and the other voltages are shown after the switch on the fuse block feeding the chart plotter/ fish finders.


Dev

Yes, on the switch.  Planning on switching it to the helm fuse block along with the plotters in the next couple of days, hopefully that'll help.
SR 17 in Vancouver, BC

Offline jamaica

Re: 12v guage
« Reply #8 on: September 17, 2018, 11:29:40 AM »
My 12v gauge only reads when the main is on. Wouldn't it be better to have it wired to a battery lead, to a fuse block or wherever that is hot when the battery switch is on, than only read when the main is running?
What I meant is that my gauge only shows voltage when my main motor, 150hp Merc, is running. Set up by PO. It shows no voltage if that motor is not running no matter how my main electrical switch is positioned. Should this be set up differently? It seems strange to me.
1994 19' Sea Ranger 150hp Merc 2stk 9.9hp Yam

Re: 12v guage
« Reply #9 on: September 17, 2018, 02:18:41 PM »
Ok, I think I figured my situation out.  I have the house and starter battery set up.  The digital gauge on my dash is connected to the same post the starter battery is connected to on the switch.  The other electronics (Garmin/Lowrance) are on the fuse block which is run on the house battery, which is why I'm getting different levels.  Also think there was a bit of resistance given the wire was not the proper gauge from the stern fuse block to the small (shitty) fuse block at the helm (which is being replaced tomorrow with 1/0 wire and the blue seas 5026 fuse block.  Hopefully this will solve a few minor issues. 

SR 17 in Vancouver, BC

Online Fisherdv

Re: 12v guage
« Reply #10 on: September 17, 2018, 02:21:38 PM »
1/0 wire to helm fuse panel is HUGE. I’d recommend 6g :twocents:
2018, Sea Chaser 16, Honda 60HP

Offline DevMah

Re: 12v guage
« Reply #11 on: September 17, 2018, 02:22:33 PM »
My 12v gauge only reads when the main is on. Wouldn't it be better to have it wired to a battery lead, to a fuse block or wherever that is hot when the battery switch is on, than only read when the main is running?
What I meant is that my gauge only shows voltage when my main motor, 150hp Merc, is running. Set up by PO. It shows no voltage if that motor is not running no matter how my main electrical switch is positioned. Should this be set up differently? It seems strange to me.

Okay then your meter is on the switched side not the battery side. This is no different than the first post.

Dev
2015 21' Sea Ranger
2015 Yamaha F150
2013 Mercury 9.9 Bigfoot 4 blade
2012 Lund 1650SS  w 2012 60HP Mercury-Sold

Offline DevMah

Re: 12v guage
« Reply #12 on: September 17, 2018, 02:26:05 PM »
1/0 wire to helm fuse panel is HUGE. I’d recommend 6g :twocents:

IMO it is  slightly overkill I would use the calculator and see what would be your requirement.


http://circuitwizard.bluesea.com/


I won’t guess and say that 6 AWG is adequate as I don’t know your applied loads nor how your system is configured.

Dev
« Last Edit: September 18, 2018, 05:16:57 PM by DevMah »
2015 21' Sea Ranger
2015 Yamaha F150
2013 Mercury 9.9 Bigfoot 4 blade
2012 Lund 1650SS  w 2012 60HP Mercury-Sold

Re: 12v guage
« Reply #13 on: September 18, 2018, 08:32:07 PM »
1/0 wire to helm fuse panel is HUGE. I’d recommend 6g :twocents:

Well too late now, I guess better safe than ...
SR 17 in Vancouver, BC

Offline davidsea

Re: 12v guage
« Reply #14 on: September 18, 2018, 11:30:17 PM »
  In my rewire, I added a dual LED voltmeter to the helm panel.  It displays both the main and house battery voltage simultaneously.  Very small, easy to mount, and a simple 3-wire hook up - 'main', 'aux', and 'ground'.   I ran  the 'main' lead to the hot side of the ignition switch in the factory engine harness, which gives me the voltage the engine sees under the hood.  The 'aux' lead goes to the fuse panel at the helm, which is fed by a 4ga run directly from the house battery. This shows the voltage available to all the accessories.  This hookup will display both voltages continuously, whether the engine is running or not, and will only go off when the master battery switch is 'off'.  If you don't want a constant display - I didn't - put an 'on-off' switch in the 'ground' lead.       Mine was from eBay :

    MICTUNING DC DUAL VOLTMETER LED DIGITAL DISPLAY UNIVERSAL FOR DUAL BATTERY     $ 13.15 , free shipping   :twocents:
1996 SR19 Hdtp. - 2018 Honda 115
2009 Duroboat 16 CC, Honda 50  -  for sale
and 19 other boats (I think, lost count)

Offline jamaica

Re: 12v guage
« Reply #15 on: September 19, 2018, 10:59:01 AM »
  In my rewire, I added a dual LED voltmeter to the helm panel.  It displays both the main and house battery voltage simultaneously.  Very small, easy to mount, and a simple 3-wire hook up - 'main', 'aux', and 'ground'.   I ran  the 'main' lead to the hot side of the ignition switch in the factory engine harness, which gives me the voltage the engine sees under the hood.  The 'aux' lead goes to the fuse panel at the helm, which is fed by a 4ga run directly from the house battery. This shows the voltage available to all the accessories.  This hookup will display both voltages continuously, whether the engine is running or not, and will only go off when the master battery switch is 'off'.  If you don't want a constant display - I didn't - put an 'on-off' switch in the 'ground' lead.       Mine was from eBay :

    MICTUNING DC DUAL VOLTMETER LED DIGITAL DISPLAY UNIVERSAL FOR DUAL BATTERY     $ 13.15 , free shipping   :twocents:

Now that's what I'm looking for. Thanks for the input.
1994 19' Sea Ranger 150hp Merc 2stk 9.9hp Yam

Offline DevMah

Re: 12v guage
« Reply #16 on: September 20, 2018, 04:39:18 PM »
  In my rewire, I added a dual LED voltmeter to the helm panel.  It displays both the main and house battery voltage simultaneously.  Very small, easy to mount, and a simple 3-wire hook up - 'main', 'aux', and 'ground'.   I ran  the 'main' lead to the hot side of the ignition switch in the factory engine harness, which gives me the voltage the engine sees under the hood.  The 'aux' lead goes to the fuse panel at the helm, which is fed by a 4ga run directly from the house battery. This shows the voltage available to all the accessories.  This hookup will display both voltages continuously, whether the engine is running or not, and will only go off when the master battery switch is 'off'.  If you don't want a constant display - I didn't - put an 'on-off' switch in the 'ground' lead.       Mine was from eBay :

    MICTUNING DC DUAL VOLTMETER LED DIGITAL DISPLAY UNIVERSAL FOR DUAL BATTERY     $ 13.15 , free shipping   :twocents:


Guys
FYI
on newer boats if you have NMEA 2000 system this can be done by the fish finder.
You can view your supply voltage and alternator charge output on your fish finder.



Dev
2015 21' Sea Ranger
2015 Yamaha F150
2013 Mercury 9.9 Bigfoot 4 blade
2012 Lund 1650SS  w 2012 60HP Mercury-Sold

Re: 12v guage
« Reply #17 on: September 21, 2018, 08:00:17 AM »
  In my rewire, I added a dual LED voltmeter to the helm panel.  It displays both the main and house battery voltage simultaneously.  Very small, easy to mount, and a simple 3-wire hook up - 'main', 'aux', and 'ground'.   I ran  the 'main' lead to the hot side of the ignition switch in the factory engine harness, which gives me the voltage the engine sees under the hood.  The 'aux' lead goes to the fuse panel at the helm, which is fed by a 4ga run directly from the house battery. This shows the voltage available to all the accessories.  This hookup will display both voltages continuously, whether the engine is running or not, and will only go off when the master battery switch is 'off'.  If you don't want a constant display - I didn't - put an 'on-off' switch in the 'ground' lead.       Mine was from eBay :

    MICTUNING DC DUAL VOLTMETER LED DIGITAL DISPLAY UNIVERSAL FOR DUAL BATTERY     $ 13.15 , free shipping   :twocents:


Guys
FYI
on newer boats if you have NMEA 2000 system this can be done by the fish finder.
You can view your supply voltage and alternator charge output on your fish finder.



Dev

Damn man, I think you've now started something else for me.  I just finished a rewire and now am considering setting up NMEA 2000.    I'm trying to grasp the true benefits of it though.  I have a Lowrance Elite 5 and a Garmin 740.  I'll be re-powering in the next couple of months with a new Yamaha 115.  Would you say there's a benefit for me to dropping in a NMEA 2000 backbone?  I'll likely add a few other devices in the near future so that may be of benefit to the whole system.  I use my boat all year, rarely sits for more than 2-3 weeks.
SR 17 in Vancouver, BC

Online Fisherdv

Re: 12v guage
« Reply #18 on: September 21, 2018, 08:17:57 AM »
  In my rewire, I added a dual LED voltmeter to the helm panel.  It displays both the main and house battery voltage simultaneously.  Very small, easy to mount, and a simple 3-wire hook up - 'main', 'aux', and 'ground'.   I ran  the 'main' lead to the hot side of the ignition switch in the factory engine harness, which gives me the voltage the engine sees under the hood.  The 'aux' lead goes to the fuse panel at the helm, which is fed by a 4ga run directly from the house battery. This shows the voltage available to all the accessories.  This hookup will display both voltages continuously, whether the engine is running or not, and will only go off when the master battery switch is 'off'.  If you don't want a constant display - I didn't - put an 'on-off' switch in the 'ground' lead.       Mine was from eBay :

    MICTUNING DC DUAL VOLTMETER LED DIGITAL DISPLAY UNIVERSAL FOR DUAL BATTERY     $ 13.15 , free shipping   :twocents:


Guys
FYI
on newer boats if you have NMEA 2000 system this can be done by the fish finder.
You can view your supply voltage and alternator charge output on your fish finder.



Dev

Damn man, I think you've now started something else for me.  I just finished a rewire and now am considering setting up NMEA 2000.    I'm trying to grasp the true benefits of it though.  I have a Lowrance Elite 5 and a Garmin 740.  I'll be re-powering in the next couple of months with a new Yamaha 115.  Would you say there's a benefit for me to dropping in a NMEA 2000 backbone?  I'll likely add a few other devices in the near future so that may be of benefit to the whole system.  I use my boat all year, rarely sits for more than 2-3 weeks.
100% yes! Easy to do (once you look at the diagram) You’ll need the NMEA 2000 harness from the motor and the NMEA 2000 starter kit. You will be able to view voltage, engine temp, RPMS, fuel used, mpg, mph, engine hours, engine trim, etc.  I run it on my boat and wouldn’t be without it now. Just make sure your ff/gps unit is NMEA 2000 compatible.
« Last Edit: September 21, 2018, 09:18:49 AM by Fisherdv »
2018, Sea Chaser 16, Honda 60HP

Re: 12v guage
« Reply #19 on: September 21, 2018, 09:23:06 AM »
Adding that to the Amazon cart as we speak - thanks again!
SR 17 in Vancouver, BC

Offline DevMah

Re: 12v guage
« Reply #20 on: September 21, 2018, 05:31:08 PM »
  In my rewire, I added a dual LED voltmeter to the helm panel.  It displays both the main and house battery voltage simultaneously.  Very small, easy to mount, and a simple 3-wire hook up - 'main', 'aux', and 'ground'.   I ran  the 'main' lead to the hot side of the ignition switch in the factory engine harness, which gives me the voltage the engine sees under the hood.  The 'aux' lead goes to the fuse panel at the helm, which is fed by a 4ga run directly from the house battery. This shows the voltage available to all the accessories.  This hookup will display both voltages continuously, whether the engine is running or not, and will only go off when the master battery switch is 'off'.  If you don't want a constant display - I didn't - put an 'on-off' switch in the 'ground' lead.       Mine was from eBay :

    MICTUNING DC DUAL VOLTMETER LED DIGITAL DISPLAY UNIVERSAL FOR DUAL BATTERY     $ 13.15 , free shipping   :twocents:


Guys
FYI
on newer boats if you have NMEA 2000 system this can be done by the fish finder.
You can view your supply voltage and alternator charge output on your fish finder.



Dev

Damn man, I think you've now started something else for me.  I just finished a rewire and now am considering setting up NMEA 2000.    I'm trying to grasp the true benefits of it though.  I have a Lowrance Elite 5 and a Garmin 740.  I'll be re-powering in the next couple of months with a new Yamaha 115.  Would you say there's a benefit for me to dropping in a NMEA 2000 backbone?  I'll likely add a few other devices in the near future so that may be of benefit to the whole system.  I use my boat all year, rarely sits for more than 2-3 weeks.
100% yes! Easy to do (once you look at the diagram) You’ll need the NMEA 2000 harness from the motor and the NMEA 2000 starter kit. You will be able to view voltage, engine temp, RPMS, fuel used, mpg, mph, engine hours, engine trim, etc.  I run it on my boat and wouldn’t be without it now. Just make sure your ff/gps unit is NMEA 2000 compatible.

Here is a link to Yamaha NMEA, you can see on this list of items you will be able to see.

http://ww2.lowrance.com/Global/Lowrance/Documents/NMEA/NMEA%202000_%20Engine%20Interface%20Essential%20Guide_3401.pdf

https://ww2.lowrance.com/Global/Lowrance/Documents/NMEA/Yamaha_Engine_NMEA2000_Connection.pdf

Dev
« Last Edit: September 21, 2018, 05:34:38 PM by DevMah »
2015 21' Sea Ranger
2015 Yamaha F150
2013 Mercury 9.9 Bigfoot 4 blade
2012 Lund 1650SS  w 2012 60HP Mercury-Sold

Re: 12v guage
« Reply #21 on: September 22, 2018, 08:36:43 AM »
Can't wait...
SR 17 in Vancouver, BC

Offline jamaica

Re: 12v guage
« Reply #22 on: September 22, 2018, 09:47:13 AM »
My '94 Merc 2 stroke is too old, for sure when I repower though.
1994 19' Sea Ranger 150hp Merc 2stk 9.9hp Yam

Re: 12v guage
« Reply #23 on: September 22, 2018, 03:17:07 PM »
My '94 Merc 2 stroke is too old, for sure when I repower though.

You must burn through fuel like I do with my 89 2 stroke Merc.  Can't wait to get this gas guzzler off the boat in a month or so....won't have to bring an extra 15 gallons on the boat every time I want to go somewhere.... :party:
SR 17 in Vancouver, BC

Offline jamaica

Re: 12v guage
« Reply #24 on: September 23, 2018, 11:29:22 AM »
The Merc is a gas guzzler but I usually don't go far so not usually a problem for me with the 48 gal tank. The good thing is the 150 HP Merc weighs almost the same as a 115 HP Yamaha, my planned upgrade. The problem is the bucks$$ after all I've done (spent) already.
1994 19' Sea Ranger 150hp Merc 2stk 9.9hp Yam