Author Topic: What is up with Defiance?  (Read 1592 times)

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What is up with Defiance?
« on: November 09, 2017, 09:32:40 AM »
Hi All,

I've been considering an Arima purchase for a year or two, and arimaowners.com is a great resource. Thank you all.

My question is: Does anyone have insight on the level of support from the factory going forward? I am asking because the website appears to be almost completely unmaintained, and they just took down their web accessories store. When was the last time they produced a color brochure?

As a newbie, it is really hard to get detailed information on current offerings, along the lines of the PDF brochures of yesteryear. That seems weird to me, and suggests that Defiance is only lukewarm about the Arima brand.

I'm not trying to open a can of worms, at all. Just want to understand why very outdated brochures posted on a user site are way better than the marketing materials from the factory. Wouldn't it be great to have a current PDF with an options grid and interior layouts?

Thanks again to all of you for the great info, Adam

Offline FishAddict

Re: What is up with Defiance?
« Reply #1 on: November 09, 2017, 10:05:34 AM »
Adam,

The key people are still working there so the new product is good quality, and parts are still available from the factory.  Don, Belinda and Terry (COB on the forum) are all great Arima people that can answer just about any question you would have.  If you walk into the showroom and say you want to go tuna fishing the sales guys are going to tell you to buy a big Defiance or Allied boat.  Tuna trips can still be done on a good day in an Arima so it's all about what your fishing needs are.  In my opinion Arima's are hard to beat...it's a do it all Ocean, Puget Sound and Columbia River boat.  Best of luck in a search for your new boat.
21ft Sea Ranger w/Yamaha F150

Offline Fisherdv

Re: What is up with Defiance?
« Reply #2 on: November 09, 2017, 10:52:56 AM »
I just had a boat built at the factory a couple of months ago and here’s my opinion. The service and support I received from Terry (COB) at the factory was great. He would send me pics and updates of the build process almost daily. Also gave me a few options on a few things I wanted done to the boat. What other boat brand has that kind of 1 on 1 personalized customer service. You can call Belinda at the factory for any parts or questions you may have. Also this forum is amazing as well, lots of good people willing to help with anything you can imagine. I’m sure folks here would be able to answer any questions you may have about boat layouts, seating, etc. Chief of the Boat, (Terry) and Belinda from the factory monitor this site also. The dedication and support of the Arima brand is definitely still strong IMHO. I don’t usually do social media. I’ve only been on this forum a short while and have over 400 posts. It’s like your not only getting a great boat , but like joining a family of Arima enthusiasts.  :twocents:
« Last Edit: November 10, 2017, 10:48:10 PM by Fisherdv »
2018, Sea Chaser 16, Honda 60HP

Offline Threeweight

Re: What is up with Defiance?
« Reply #3 on: November 09, 2017, 10:59:29 AM »
Defiance bought Arima a few years ago when Juichi Arima wound down the company sold the molds during the recession.  Defiance later hired most of the old Arima factory staff back and restarted production.  Was a good move by Defiance, as Arima's are a well-known Pacific Northwest brand and basically sell themselves.  They made some design improvements (replaced the remaining wood in the boat with composite, new hardtop designs, etc...)

However, Arima is a low-volume brand and the boats are very labor intensive.  Defiance' own boats are bigger, much more $$$$, and aimed more at ocean use.  They are trying to build up that brand (and get into the tin can market through their new Allied line of boats).  My guess is both these product lines offer much higher margins than Arima, and have the potential to sell a lot more boats.  So that's where their marketing budget goes.

As far as the online parts store and such, scroll down and you can see where Belinda was on the board announcing that change.  The reality is that only a few thousand Arima boats have been built, total, in the history of the brand.  It isn't like there is a giant market out there for this service.  You can still buy parts direct from Defiance, you just need to call.
« Last Edit: November 09, 2017, 01:22:10 PM by Threeweight »
Former Sea Chaser 17 owner
Wild Card, Hewescraft Ocean Pro 220, Honda 225 and 9.9

“Never turn your back on fear. It should always be in front of you, like a thing that might have to be killed.”
       --- Hunter S. Thompson

Re: What is up with Defiance?
« Reply #4 on: November 09, 2017, 12:16:43 PM »
Thanks everyone for the great answers. The marketing makes more sense now that I understand the low volume/low margin aspect.

My "problem" is that I can't find the info I want without personal contact, and I'd love to browse from a distance before I take that step. Prime example is that I have no clue what current interior layouts are available, and it would be great to show that kind of stuff to the wife as a warm up. So, I look at ~20 year old brochures and browse photos from existing owners (and thank you all again for the great info). I can get part of the way there, but it's a lot tougher than having up to date info on what's currently available.

-Adam



Offline Fisherdv

Re: What is up with Defiance?
« Reply #5 on: November 09, 2017, 12:23:58 PM »
Adam, I’m not completely sure but I really don’t think much has changed in the layouts. Maybe someone with more knowledge can confirm. I referenced several photos online before my purchase also, and don’t see any major differences aside from starboard panels instead of wood, and composite transom
2018, Sea Chaser 16, Honda 60HP

Offline Threeweight

Re: What is up with Defiance?
« Reply #6 on: November 09, 2017, 01:22:49 PM »
Corrected my post... Arima never declared bankruptcy.  A former employee corrected me... Mr. Arima wound down the company with their debts paid in full.  Defiance later bought the molds.
Former Sea Chaser 17 owner
Wild Card, Hewescraft Ocean Pro 220, Honda 225 and 9.9

“Never turn your back on fear. It should always be in front of you, like a thing that might have to be killed.”
       --- Hunter S. Thompson

Offline BurnsieBabe

Re: What is up with Defiance?
« Reply #7 on: November 09, 2017, 01:24:09 PM »
To AdamInBellingham.  New Brochures are made up every year or two since we need them for dealers and boat shows.  Just send me an email with your address and I will get a brochure out to you!

Belinda
belindadefiancemarine@gmail.com
360-813-3600

Re: What is up with Defiance?
« Reply #8 on: November 09, 2017, 01:51:58 PM »
Thanks Belinda. I just emailed you.

-Adam

Offline Dhil12

Re: What is up with Defiance?
« Reply #9 on: November 09, 2017, 02:57:49 PM »
Adam, as a proud new owner of an Arima, I can tell you Belinda, Don and Terry were awesome to deal with. They helped me and answered every question I had. My wife and I were even invited to the factory to see our boat being built. The personal attention given to us was more than I expected, and the whole group of Arima/ Defiance made our purchase a very pleasant and memorable experience. It's more like a family than just buying a boat from someone you would never meet and know.
Darrell
2018 Sea Legend ht with bulkhead
2018 Yamaha 200
9.9 yamaha kicker

Offline StreamFixer

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Re: What is up with Defiance?
« Reply #10 on: November 09, 2017, 05:41:00 PM »
Hi Adam

Welcome aboard...  You have raised a number of interesting questions

Floor plans:  They have not changed since the first couple of years, nor are there much in the way of options for modifying the basic floor plan until you get in to the 22SL.

A couple of top options are available in all the other models(sizes)

This keeps the production needs to the basic molds, thus keeping costs down and the benefit of:  If I am talking about a change to a 17 SC, everyone who has one knows pretty much what I am talking about.

StreamFixer
'97 19SC w/ Salt Boss Top
'03 Yamaha 115 EFI
'05 Yamaha T8 Solas 4 blade prop

"By the grace of God we travel upon the rivers and sea..
They, like He, are mightier than me."  Mike Jesperson aka 'Nalu'

Offline darci

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Re: What is up with Defiance?
« Reply #11 on: November 12, 2017, 03:35:41 PM »
Folks, I got the usual  RNRI ("right now, right information") from Belinda this week on a kicker bracket and skip top price and availability.

 This is a comfort!

Re: What is up with Defiance?
« Reply #12 on: December 18, 2017, 08:10:21 AM »
I know what you mean - the photos on the Arima website have been the same since the Internet was invented! It would be easy and inexpensive to upgrade the website to something fresh and up to date.
2000 SC17 with 2018 Yamaha 90 hp.
Home port = Trinidad, CA.

Offline StreamFixer

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Re: What is up with Defiance?
« Reply #13 on: December 18, 2017, 10:20:46 AM »
Yeah!!  All they have to do is hire someone with the skills to do a professional web page job...  Which takes away from the $$$ available for production skills...  When they are just barely keeping up with orders as it is... 

Hmmmm   :stooges:

StreamFixer
'97 19SC w/ Salt Boss Top
'03 Yamaha 115 EFI
'05 Yamaha T8 Solas 4 blade prop

"By the grace of God we travel upon the rivers and sea..
They, like He, are mightier than me."  Mike Jesperson aka 'Nalu'

Offline Yachter Yat

Re: What is up with Defiance?
« Reply #14 on: December 18, 2017, 01:02:14 PM »
   Fixer;  Wouldn't it be possible (and perhaps more economical) to simply hire an outside contractor to upgrade the Arima website?  I mean.....hiring an employee for this??  Just sayin'. 

Yat
Dear Arima:  Please "square-off" the Hunter transom.  Make it like my old 77 Silverline.  Thank you.  Oh yeah...please hurry; I'm getting old.

16 SC/Honda 60

Offline StreamFixer

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Re: What is up with Defiance?
« Reply #15 on: December 18, 2017, 01:17:34 PM »
Sure, and I suspect that is how they would go about it...  It's all a matter of prioritizing cash flow and employee focus.  Since I have no dogs in the fight, I will get back on my porch and tie up my dog...   :smile1:

StreamFixer
'97 19SC w/ Salt Boss Top
'03 Yamaha 115 EFI
'05 Yamaha T8 Solas 4 blade prop

"By the grace of God we travel upon the rivers and sea..
They, like He, are mightier than me."  Mike Jesperson aka 'Nalu'

Offline GHMariner

Re: What is up with Defiance?
« Reply #16 on: February 14, 2018, 08:17:05 AM »
Having worked with Arima and Defiance Marine on a professional level in the past, I'll keep my personal feelings about the ownership and sales staff to myself. But I will say that Belinda and Don are both fantastic to work with and are focused on not just customer service after the sale, but putting out a quality product at a reasonable price. On top of that, they're just plain nice people.

I was so pleased when I came here and saw that they were active posters.

Offline mustang65fbk

Re: What is up with Defiance?
« Reply #17 on: February 15, 2018, 02:20:09 PM »
Did they move their parts website somewhere else or is it just me?  I click on the "parts" section of the ArimaBoats.com website and it goes to a third party website that you can "buy the domain."
2003 21' Sea Ranger Skip Top
2004 Honda 130hp 4 Stroke

Offline FWilliams

Re: What is up with Defiance?
« Reply #18 on: February 15, 2018, 03:56:52 PM »
they got rid of the parts  pages and just want you to call them to inquire about part availability. I think it sucks.
2007 21 ft. Sea Ranger HT 115 Yamaha 4 stroke  9.9 Yamaha 4 stroke

Offline Markshoreline

Re: What is up with Defiance?
« Reply #19 on: February 15, 2018, 05:30:01 PM »
Going to manual human powered order taking seems opposite of Google's Go Grocery store model that doesn't even have cashiers.  Maybe Arima is on to something?
2002 Sea Ranger HT 21, Yamaha 150, Yamaha 9.9

Offline Chief of the Boat

Re: What is up with Defiance?
« Reply #20 on: February 15, 2018, 05:31:40 PM »
If you need Arima parts call Belinda at the Dealership. 
1994 Sea Explorer 1511 loves whitecaps 2010 Yamaha F-70 2012 Yamaha F-8 with a  Fixed SaltBoss Bracket Lowrance HDS-5 & 7 Gen 2 Standard Horizon Fixed VHF 2150 with AIS

Offline Marine40

Re: What is up with Defiance?
« Reply #21 on: February 15, 2018, 08:22:04 PM »
I spent a half hour with her (Belinda) at the shop this last weekend and she is a huge reason why I still have an Arima boat. I hope Defiance understands what they have!




Darren
« Last Edit: February 15, 2018, 09:25:50 PM by Marine40 »
Have -15' Hunter, Had - 2 each 17' Rangers, Had - 1 each 17 Skip Chaser, Had - 1 each 19' Skip Chaser, Have - 21' Skip Ranger.

Offline GregE

Re: What is up with Defiance?
« Reply #22 on: February 15, 2018, 09:26:45 PM »
Spent some time with Belinda and Don today.  Over the years they have always been knowledgeable and helpful
Greg
Osprey 26 LC Kodak;  Arima SR 19 HT; SL 22 Honda 225
http://www.sagecreekforums.com/phpforum/index.php
Sold:  Arima SE 16 WeeBait; SH 15 WeeBoat;
SR 21 NoBait;  SL 22 ReBait

Offline BurnsieBabe

Re: What is up with Defiance?
« Reply #23 on: February 15, 2018, 10:08:55 PM »
 Thanks for the kind words from many of you. If you do not want to call, just email me. I'll do my best to get back to you.


Belindadefiancemarine@gmail.com
360-813-3600

Or message me through this site.

I'll post newest brochure tomorrow so you can browse newer photos. The truth is, we do not change things in these boats just to say we changed for a model year. We try for continuity. That being said, some changes have been made, over the years, due to availability of parts. Some get discontinued while others we have upgraded due comments from owners. What we have not changed, is the design, except a few tweaks over the years.

Belinda

Offline Markshoreline

Re: What is up with Defiance?
« Reply #24 on: February 15, 2018, 10:11:16 PM »
Yep, they are both awesome with encyclopedic knowledge of all things Arima.  It’s just that online ordering would be so easy for the customer and the business.  What happened with that?
2002 Sea Ranger HT 21, Yamaha 150, Yamaha 9.9