Author Topic: bilge Pump Wiring Question  (Read 441 times)

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Offline BruceL2_Fish

bilge Pump Wiring Question
« on: November 01, 2017, 04:24:45 PM »
Ok, I am no expert on wiring and you guys that know what you are doing have helped me before so, before I assume I know the right way I thought I would seek the wisdom of our group.
I am in the process of adding a second bilge pump.   It is a Rule LoPro 900 gph with the auto function.   It has 3 wires, ground, auto and manual.  my boat also has a second bilge switch at the helm but no second pump in the bilge.   I have checked and my tank is out.

So my question is do I assume the switch is already wired and I need to look for the wires?   Should I forget about that switch as it most likely is not wired with marine grade wire anyway and add a switch in the back?

I would assume I could always run all new wire up to the existing switch.  Would I make two wire runs?   One for the manual function and that would be ran to the fuse panel the switch and then back to the pump and one direct to the battery with inline fuse to the auto side of switch and then back to pump.   the ground runs direct to negative buss.  Is this the best way?   
2012 Sea Ranger 19 (M. LaDeane)
Suzuki 115 Four Stroke
Honda 9.9 Kicker

Offline Threeweight

Re: bilge Pump Wiring Question
« Reply #1 on: November 01, 2017, 04:55:32 PM »
Best way... ground to a ground bus bar at the stern some where, two positives to a 3 way switch at the helm (on/off/auto).  Stern if you prefer that, but switch will be out in the weather and won't last as long, and easier to bump.

I like the "off" option just in case you have some need to disable the pump (short, fuel spill, etc...)
Former Sea Chaser 17 owner
Wild Card, Hewescraft Ocean Pro 220, Honda 225 and 9.9

“Never turn your back on fear. It should always be in front of you, like a thing that might have to be killed.”
       --- Hunter S. Thompson

Offline DevMah

Re: bilge Pump Wiring Question
« Reply #2 on: November 01, 2017, 06:42:19 PM »
If you have a rear B- bus then attach the negative to the back

Is your switch a three position on/off/on? Or just a on/off two position?

Three position switch (as Threeweights describes)
Put auto on one position of the switch
Manual on the other
B+ from the front panel fuse block

Two position switch
Put manual off the one position
Feed both the switch and auto together from the front/rear fuse block (one fuse).


IMO

I would only pull one fuse either at the front or back. I would recommend to fuse at the front as if it ever failed it easier to replace at the helm then at the batteries.


FYI
I have both my pumps on one switch
Position 1 only activates one pump on auto
Position 2 activates both on manual.
My switch has a 20A resettable circuit breaker, but after the switch each bilge pump is fused independently.

The orientation is all up to you ...you an see if the switch has wires on the back and trace them to see thier condition.

Dev
« Last Edit: November 01, 2017, 06:56:44 PM by DevMah »
2015 21' Sea Ranger
2015 Yamaha F150
2013 Mercury 9.9 Bigfoot 4 blade
2012 Lund 1650SS  w 2012 60HP Mercury-Sold

Offline BruceL2_Fish

Re: bilge Pump Wiring Question
« Reply #3 on: November 02, 2017, 04:53:11 AM »
Guys, thanks for your advise.   I do have a 3 position switch at the helm already.  I will pull the switch panel and see if anything is wired to it.   I have seen some recommend powering direct from battery so the pump can run even with main power switch turned off or if there is a problem with main feed supply.  Thoughts?
2012 Sea Ranger 19 (M. LaDeane)
Suzuki 115 Four Stroke
Honda 9.9 Kicker

Online Hydroman

Re: bilge Pump Wiring Question
« Reply #4 on: November 02, 2017, 08:02:41 AM »
Bruce

My TJ OS has a dedicated fuse panel mounted in the stern of the boat that is connected directly to the engine battery.  This panel provides power to one of the bilge pumps, bilge high water alarm and VHF radio.

Jim
17 Sea Chaser (sold)
21 Skip Tower (sold)
27 Thunder Jet OS

Offline StreamFixer

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Re: bilge Pump Wiring Question
« Reply #5 on: November 02, 2017, 08:48:19 AM »
Bruce:

My opinion, for what it is worth...  I would not wire anything direct to the battery, bypassing the shut off switch unless---  I run one battery connected and a charged spare.  If I needed something to run when the power was off, such as a automatic bulge pump, I would connect it to the spare battery.

For me, running something off the main battery when away from the boat is an invitation to have a dead battery when you try to get things going like starting your motor...

Just my opinion...

StreamFixer
'97 19SC w/ Salt Boss Top
'03 Yamaha 115 EFI
'05 Yamaha T8 Solas 4 blade prop

"By the grace of God we travel upon the rivers and sea..
They, like He, are mightier than me."  Mike Jesperson aka 'Nalu'

Offline Diablo

Re: bilge Pump Wiring Question
« Reply #6 on: November 02, 2017, 09:34:01 AM »
Bruce:

My opinion, for what it is worth...  I would not wire anything direct to the battery, bypassing the shut off switch unless---  I run one battery connected and a charged spare.  If I needed something to run when the power was off, such as a automatic bulge pump, I would connect it to the spare battery.

For me, running something off the main battery when away from the boat is an invitation to have a dead battery when you try to get things going like starting your motor...

Just my opinion...

StreamFixer

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'98 19SR  '15 E Tec 115, '10 Honda 8
'88 17SR  '90 Johnson 90, Honda 8, SOLD

Offline darci

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Re: bilge Pump Wiring Question
« Reply #7 on: November 02, 2017, 11:00:34 AM »
Bruce, I use to keep Darci in the slip (in Juneau Alaska) year around for about four years.
I had shore power but when I was away I put a fully charged battery (fused) directly to an automatic bilge pump in the fish box, hose into the motor well.
A battery tender was plugged into the shore power connected to the battery.

That and about six ropes all tarped up and I still worried.

Nothing bad ever happened.
Well, someone helped themselves to about twenty gallons of pre-mix one time...

Offline Threeweight

Re: bilge Pump Wiring Question
« Reply #8 on: November 02, 2017, 11:02:00 AM »
Gonna argue with Russ.  I believe the standard boat wiring regs allow for 1 bilge pump and 1 vhf radio to be connected to a battery (or bypassing the main power switch).

The idea being that in the event of a fire or other emergency where you have to shut off the power, there is still one functioning bilge pump and a functioning way to radio for help.  If you moor your boat, you need some way of pumping water out while the main power is turned off.

A hand-held radio may negate the need for #2, but I think #1 is still a good idea (fused, and with a switch of some kind).
Former Sea Chaser 17 owner
Wild Card, Hewescraft Ocean Pro 220, Honda 225 and 9.9

“Never turn your back on fear. It should always be in front of you, like a thing that might have to be killed.”
       --- Hunter S. Thompson

Online Hydroman

Re: bilge Pump Wiring Question
« Reply #9 on: November 02, 2017, 11:45:42 AM »
Bruce

My TJ OS has a dedicated fuse panel mounted in the stern of the boat that is connected directly to the engine battery.  This panel provides power to one of the bilge pumps, bilge high water alarm and VHF radio.

Jim

This is in accordance with ABYC wiring recommendations.
Jim
17 Sea Chaser (sold)
21 Skip Tower (sold)
27 Thunder Jet OS

Offline DevMah

Re: bilge Pump Wiring Question
« Reply #10 on: November 03, 2017, 04:26:10 PM »
Bruce

My TJ OS has a dedicated fuse panel mounted in the stern of the boat that is connected directly to the engine battery.  This panel provides power to one of the bilge pumps, bilge high water alarm and VHF radio.

Jim

This is in accordance with ABYC wiring recommendations.
Jim

Transportation Canada has adopted ABYC hovever  this is not the case for USA as they go by USCG CFR

Here is the requirement for Canada
8.6.2 Battery Disconnect Switch

8.6.2.1 A battery disconnect switch shall be installed in the positive conductor from each battery or group of batteries, with a cold cranking average rating greater than 800 amperes, except for small vessels less than 8.0 m (26 ft 3 in) in length.

8.6.2.2 The following devices may be connected to the battery side of the battery switch described in paragraph 8.6.2.1; however, each device shall be provided with circuit protection in accordance with section 8.9:

-electronic equipment with continuously powered memory;
-safety equipment such as bilge pumps, alarms, carbon monoxide (CO) detectors, and bilge blowers;
-battery charging equipment.

It is common practice to have these devices directly off the house battery, but you can also off the main if only a single battery system.

Usually a unswitched fused  B+ line is pulled to the helm and has its own distribution  fusing for these type of devices.

Dev
« Last Edit: November 03, 2017, 04:34:04 PM by DevMah »
2015 21' Sea Ranger
2015 Yamaha F150
2013 Mercury 9.9 Bigfoot 4 blade
2012 Lund 1650SS  w 2012 60HP Mercury-Sold

Offline BruceL2_Fish

Re: bilge Pump Wiring Question
« Reply #11 on: November 03, 2017, 04:52:38 PM »
devMah, thanks for the information.   I tend to think I will set it up with a direct line coming from house battery and properly fused.   I like the idea of leaving the pump powered for auto operation when moored.   I normally only moored for a few days at a time when at Neah Bay or Westport.   I also like to turn off the main power switch when I leave the boat.  So this give me that option as well as the off position to interrupt when I want.
Russ also appreciate your input but tend to want to follow 3WT on the thought process for this pump as I have for one of my 2 VHS radio's on the boat.
2012 Sea Ranger 19 (M. LaDeane)
Suzuki 115 Four Stroke
Honda 9.9 Kicker

Offline StreamFixer

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Re: bilge Pump Wiring Question
« Reply #12 on: November 03, 2017, 05:20:34 PM »
You certainly will not hear any argument from me.  I just run two batteries...

StreamFixer
'97 19SC w/ Salt Boss Top
'03 Yamaha 115 EFI
'05 Yamaha T8 Solas 4 blade prop

"By the grace of God we travel upon the rivers and sea..
They, like He, are mightier than me."  Mike Jesperson aka 'Nalu'