Author Topic: twin motors  (Read 682 times)

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Offline Reel BAD

twin motors
« on: April 14, 2017, 08:25:20 AM »
I want to power my 17' SR with twin Suzuki 60hp (new style). Looking for info regarding space issues and steering hook up. Has anyone put twins on a 17'? Do you have pics of installation? Thanks.

Online Hydroman

Re: twin motors
« Reply #1 on: April 14, 2017, 08:55:29 AM »
There have been a few with twin Honda 45,  wouldn't want combine weight to exceed weight of main and kicker.

Jim

Offline La-Z-Buoy

Re: twin motors
« Reply #2 on: April 14, 2017, 10:19:01 AM »
If I'm reading the Suzuki web site correctly that's in the neighborhood of 460 lbs. The 90 is 343, plus a 4 stroke kicker (around 90-100 lbs). I guess you'd be in the ballpark weight wise. As said, there have been at least 1 arima on here with twin 45's. With 2 60's you are right at the top for rated HP for a 17.

Give us your thought process for this. Screaming deal on the motors? Troll with one and have decent HP to get back in if one goes belly up?

Many years ago (over 50  :facepalm: ) my uncle had a little wood boat made by Skippercraft. Neat boat, powered by twin 18 horse Evinrudes. Believe it or not it would pull 1 skier. He's probably the one that gave me the "Boat Bug".
« Last Edit: April 14, 2017, 10:55:37 AM by La-Z-Buoy »
Richard

1991 19' Sea Ranger HT
DF 140 Suzuki, Honda 8

Offline amazing grace

Re: twin motors
« Reply #3 on: April 14, 2017, 10:25:26 AM »
While I like the concept, a smaller
Arima does not seem to be the best candidate  imho.

I am sure  you have done the benefit vs non benefit analysis. I know of one board member who had one before he sold it with twin Yamaha 50's.

I would consider it on my  C-Dory if repowering but would likely not just due to the extra cost initially and the extra cost of maintenance or two motors and steering components.

My Etec is going to keep me going many years in to the future I am guessing.

Good luck.
1989 22' C-Dory Angler

Offline Threeweight

Re: twin motors
« Reply #4 on: April 14, 2017, 12:03:51 PM »
I have fished many boats with twins.  IMO, they make no sense on an Arima.

17's run butt heavy to begin with, and they were designed in an era of 250-300# two stroke 90 hp engines.  I repowered my old 17 with a single Suzuki (DF90a), and with an 80# kicker plus stern mounted batteries it was really butt heavy.  So butt heavy I'd take seawater through the steering cable boot in a following sea with three guys in it.

I relocated my batteries forward, which helped a lot with load balance and ride.

Main benefit of twins is redundancy in an offshore boat (if just one of the motors has the power to plane the hull, otherwise you are stuck running at the same speed a 9.9 kicker could push you).  They also provide much better low speed handling, and better low end power for getting on plane with a really heavy load.

Downside is up front purchase $$, increased maintenance costs, weight, and worse fuel economy. 

Former Sea Chaser 17 owner
Wild Card, Hewescraft Ocean Pro 220, Honda 225 and 9.9

“Never turn your back on fear. It should always be in front of you, like a thing that might have to be killed.”
       --- Hunter S. Thompson

Offline Chief of the Boat

Re: twin motors
« Reply #5 on: April 14, 2017, 02:20:14 PM »
A few months ago we sent a brand new 21 Sea Ranger Skip Tower to Guam once it gets there the Dealer will install twin Yamaha F70's.  Notice the cut out in the port motor well for the steering arm.  Twins on a Arima the motor has to be tilted to trailer in the center position.  In this application twins make sense.     
1994 Sea Explorer 1511 loves whitecaps 2010 Yamaha F-70 2012 Yamaha F-8 with a  Fixed SaltBoss Bracket Lowrance HDS-5 & 7 Gen 2 Standard Horizon Fixed VHF 2150 with AIS

Offline Chief of the Boat

Re: twin motors
« Reply #6 on: April 14, 2017, 03:36:49 PM »
1994 Sea Explorer 1511 loves whitecaps 2010 Yamaha F-70 2012 Yamaha F-8 with a  Fixed SaltBoss Bracket Lowrance HDS-5 & 7 Gen 2 Standard Horizon Fixed VHF 2150 with AIS

Offline Danno

Re: twin motors
« Reply #7 on: April 14, 2017, 09:36:27 PM »
Did you include an ArimaOwners.cm key fob? It would be great to get a Guam Arima member here
Previously owned a 1998 19' SR

Lures are designed to catch fishermen not fish.

Offline wedocq

Re: twin motors
« Reply #8 on: April 14, 2017, 09:52:08 PM »
COB,
Are you accidently releasing some trade secrets with this photo? Is an Arima Cat in the works?? :biggrin: Or is that just a Livingston that happens to have the Arima color and trim?   :bigshock:
-Shawn



2002 21' Arima Sea Ranger HT  Suzuki DF175 4-stroke.
WEDOCQ= WE DO SEKIU! It pays homage to my Uncle Jay who died of cancer.

Online Mcneilcab

Re: twin motors
« Reply #9 on: April 14, 2017, 10:47:26 PM »
 I bought a sea ranger 19ht last winter with twin Honda 50hp 4 strokes...about 205 lbs dry each I believe....went to upgrade my steering to hydraulic  and had to buy seastar to tie into the second motor..there was not enough room to fit the cylinder. No way was I doing surgery on the motor well.That unit went back and I'm going to try a transom mount seastar  with a tie bar. Hope it fits? Another issue is placement of transom mount transducers and trimtabs..Things are tight
Won't get the boat finished for a few more weekends. With outboards that small I have been told you don't have the option of counter rotating props
I will post results in a few weeks when she's out on the water.
1994 SR19HT W/TWIN 50s
1998 SEA LEGEND HT  W/TWIN 90s

Offline Holoholo808

Re: twin motors
« Reply #10 on: April 15, 2017, 03:53:58 AM »
One of the guys down here was running a 17 SC with twin 45 or 50s.  The boat was used for trolling offshore so the reasoning for twins was for redundancy to get home as the waves/currents/wind can make the return trip home really long with a 9.9 hp kicker.  He put on the Doelfins in lieu of trim tabs and said the rear end would torque steer/slide out really bad; pulled them off and the boat behaved better.  Didn't necessarily mind the lack of tabs as the water is rarely calm enough to get up on plane and he could control his list by trimming the individual motors.  The heavy stern is nice when you're heading down seas and the boat starts to want to surf; feels a lot safer with the rear squatting; just make sure your bilge pumps work  :doh:
1611 SC Honda BF90D

For easier searching go to Google and type "site:www.arimaowners.com (search term)"

Offline Chief of the Boat

Re: twin motors
« Reply #11 on: April 15, 2017, 08:09:20 AM »
Defiance bought George Sorensen's molds, and have been building Sorensen's for some time.  McNeilcab look at the picture with the dive ladder and the piece of cardboard taped on the motor well that is where you cut out the motor well wall.  The factory makes a fiberglass piece that recesses the well a few inches to clear the steering.   Danno forgot the fob. :doh:
1994 Sea Explorer 1511 loves whitecaps 2010 Yamaha F-70 2012 Yamaha F-8 with a  Fixed SaltBoss Bracket Lowrance HDS-5 & 7 Gen 2 Standard Horizon Fixed VHF 2150 with AIS

Offline Ko Ho

Re: twin motors
« Reply #12 on: April 15, 2017, 10:07:27 AM »
I've been running twin Yamaha 40's on my 17 SC for 11 years now. This was suggested to me by Don at Arima, and he couldn't have been more right. Don't know what kind of fishing you do (if any), but for salmon trolling, it can't be beat. I essentially have TWO QUIET trolling motors, with full steering, throttle, and instrumentation at the helm. Each motor has an alternator, so I'm always charging, and with the digital tachometers, I can control speed at 100 RPM increments. The motors can also be used as twin screws when docking - i.e. I can literally rotate the boat on its axis, and almost move sideways. I'll use both motors getting to the fishing grounds, then all I have to do is shut one down - and I'm trolling! No lifting, starting, or warming up a kicker. And no fiddling with an EZ steer. Perhaps the best thing is the trolling itself. Since the motors are right next to the boat's centerline (as opposed to 3 feet off to port), the boat tracks true, even into a headwind. In my old boat with 90 hp main and 8 hp kicker, I had to use the main on windy days. Also, since the motors are tucked between the sponsons, I don't have to worry about the downrigger lines hitting the props when turning.

I had heard some negative things about twins and I asked Don about them, and he dismissed them all, and he was right:

Weight - My 40's are 185 pounds each for a total of 370. Back in 2006, the 90 HP main I was considering was 340 pounds. Add 100 for a kicker AND some poundage for the bracket, and it was way heavier for a main and separate kicker. ALSO, since the kicker sits well BEHIND the transom, it exerts a lot of downward torque on the rear end, pulling it down further (not to mention bouncing around when trailering). My current boat sits level in the water, which also improves getting out of the hole when accelerating.

Power/speed - I heard that having 2 lower units in the water would cause speed-draining friction. Don said this was negligible, and my "80 HP" boat does 34 MPH at WOT, though I rarely go over 25 for safety's sake.

Counterrotation - I heard that without counter rotating props the boat would handle poorly. I doesn't. At all.

I have some pictures in the gallery. I'd recommend you talk with Don Meyer at Arima/Defiance, as this is a subject he is enthusiastic about. Twin 60's might be more power than you need.

Offline Ko Ho

Re: twin motors
« Reply #13 on: April 15, 2017, 10:31:41 AM »
OOPs. Apologies to Don. I meant Don Gross at Arima/Defiance. Don Meyer was an old teacher of mine. Senior moment. :doh:

Offline BestBoats

Re: twin motors
« Reply #14 on: April 15, 2017, 10:42:53 AM »
Question for you twin guys that I have seen on here...will one 50 or 60 put the 19 in plane? Will one 40 or 50 put the 17 on plane? Will one 90 put the 21 on plane.  Always been curious about were that threshold is.  Thanks!
2007 21' Sea Ranger Hardtop "THE A-TEAM"
150 Evinrude Etec
9.9 Susuki EFI

Offline Ko Ho

Re: twin motors
« Reply #15 on: April 15, 2017, 11:45:50 AM »
One of my 40's will not plane my 17SC. Almost, but not quite. I think it's the weight of the other motor that keeps the boat in the hole.

Offline Doryboy

Re: twin motors
« Reply #16 on: April 16, 2017, 08:24:20 PM »
Here are a few pictures of the twins on my 1989 17' Chaser. Can't tell you much from experience about using them as I've only had it out once since I bought it last year.  :facepalm: I can tell you I would like to switch to a single main and kicker at some point. I don't care for all the wires and cables back there and it's a bit of a pain to do work on them when you can't really stand beside them easily. Anybody want a pair of Mercury Classic 50s ??? :smile1:






1989 17' Sea Chaser

Offline Chief of the Boat

Re: twin motors
« Reply #17 on: May 19, 2017, 05:47:10 PM »
Here is the 21 Sea Ranger we shipped to Guam.   I need to call the Dealer in Guam get a sea trial report.
1994 Sea Explorer 1511 loves whitecaps 2010 Yamaha F-70 2012 Yamaha F-8 with a  Fixed SaltBoss Bracket Lowrance HDS-5 & 7 Gen 2 Standard Horizon Fixed VHF 2150 with AIS

Offline Salmon King

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Re: twin motors
« Reply #18 on: May 19, 2017, 07:18:47 PM »
COB,
Are you accidently releasing some trade secrets with this photo? Is an Arima Cat in the works?? :biggrin: Or is that just a Livingston that happens to have the Arima color and trim?   :bigshock:
-Shawn





Arima Cat?
16' Center Consolewith a flat deck (the only reason I hate a Livingston) maybe?
I'd be ALL IN on that one!!
Gee for once in my life I would have a brand new boat!!

PLEASE...Fly your flag Proudly, and remember to thank a Vet!
9’ Pontoon (Bismarck)
8’ Pontoon (Hood)