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Arima Forum => Electronics and Electrical => Topic started by: Mr.Petersen on December 04, 2017, 07:08:00 PM

Title: Rewire project - help me spend my money
Post by: Mr.Petersen on December 04, 2017, 07:08:00 PM
Hey all, I'm working on a rewire to my boat. I am planning on adding a battery to my boat and I have a rough diagram of what I was planning on doing and I wanted to consult the experts on what they though.

I have attached a wiring diagram but still had a few questions.

1. Does this diagram make sense? I'm planning on putting a negative and positive bus bar in both the front and back of the boat.
2. From the add a battery kit should I run two separate cables from the kit for the main and kicker or can I run a large cable to a bus and split it from the bus. As well from each motor on the way back to the kit meet at a bus and then make the run back with one large cable.
3. For electronics that are on switches, where do I put the switches? I'm thinking that they go on the positive line with the correct fuses between the Switch and the electronic ( Bus+ >> Switch >> Fuse >> Electronics >> Bus-) 
Title: Re: Rewire project - help me spend my money
Post by: Mr.Petersen on December 04, 2017, 07:20:45 PM
Here is the drawing.
Title: Re: Rewire project - help me spend my money
Post by: DevMah on December 04, 2017, 08:53:13 PM
IMO

To many connections cause to many problems....
I would minimize the number of bus terminals...

-Off the house side battery switch that feeds both bow and stern fuse panels I would install  the dual MRBF block 2151 blue seas and remove the bus bar. That also eliminates the fuse that you have before the 2 fuse panels.

- On the stern panel I would recommend a Saftey hub 100/150 blue seas 7725 7748
-install the fuse on the negative of the ACR
-have only one negative bus bar for stern (combine the engine negative to the rear distribution negative bus)
When fusing your cables the fuses should always be located as close to the battery positive. This way you protect as much cable as you can.


Dev
Title: Re: Rewire project - help me spend my money
Post by: Mr.Petersen on December 04, 2017, 10:16:23 PM
Thanks dev, I think that makes sense. I'll try and redraw it up and see if I have it right.
Title: Re: Rewire project - help me spend my money
Post by: GregE on December 04, 2017, 10:28:21 PM
Wiring problem?!?!  SR 19 dealer and previous owners method....

Thought we'd make it all better   :biggrin:  I've upgraded all of the boat's wiring we've had-  and later sold them.  Hope the new owners appreciate it   :shrug9:
Title: Re: Rewire project - help me spend my money
Post by: Mr.Petersen on December 05, 2017, 09:51:39 AM
Here is the round 2 wiring diagram based off my understanding of what Dev was recommending.

I highlighted the areas where I wasn't sure what I was doing.
1. In the bottom right is this the right places to put the switches for devices like the bilge pump, electronics and deck lights?
2. I wasn't sure how to connect the negative electrical stuffs. I looked at a blue sea diagram online and I think that I put this in here correctly.
3. For the bow, I could go with a fuse panel that does not have a negative bus bar as part of the panel and then from the electronics go straight to the main (-) bus that will be in the front, wire runs would be the same for the devices seems like this would be a better way to do it.  But I'm not sure.
4. Also for my downriggers I was hoping to install a "Blue Sea 7181 - 30 Amp" on the runs  to the downriggers. Since the power for these would come off the 7725 in the back could I put a 50-100 amp fuse in the 7725 and then put the line so that only the 7181 ever pops..... This seems like a complex solution to a problem that might not be a problem.
Title: Re: Rewire project - help me spend my money
Post by: Rokefin on December 05, 2017, 11:19:12 AM
 "I've upgraded all of the boat's wiring we've had-  and later sold them.  Hope the new owners appreciate it"

Love that clean work you electrical wizards do :applause:

I'm sure they appreciate it......I'd really appreciate it if you did my rats nest :hoboy:
Title: Re: Rewire project - help me spend my money
Post by: GregE on December 05, 2017, 02:32:47 PM
Kraken
put a neg buss bar up front for all the electronics, run One heavier ground wire to the rear neg buss.
Title: Re: Rewire project - help me spend my money
Post by: Mr.Petersen on December 05, 2017, 03:37:56 PM
Greg,

I modified the drawing again. I'm not sure what you meant with the ground. If I took it from the negative bus in the back where would it attach to?

As far as in the bow, since the batteries are getting moved forward I can use the negative bus that would be attached to the acr to attach all forward electronics. The run would be the same as if I added an additional bus and I think thats redundant as there would already be on there.

In purple is the change as I think you laid it out.

You could either draw on this where to connect the grounds or say from (-) bus stern connected to (mystery spot?). Also from reading how other boats are grounded I'm not sure if my boat has a ground.
Title: Re: Rewire project - help me spend my money
Post by: DevMah on December 05, 2017, 04:37:57 PM
Here is the round 2 wiring diagram based off my understanding of what Dev was recommending.

I highlighted the areas where I wasn't sure what I was doing.
1. In the bottom right is this the right places to put the switches for devices like the bilge pump, electronics and deck lights?
2. I wasn't sure how to connect the negative electrical stuffs. I looked at a blue sea diagram online and I think that I put this in here correctly.
3. For the bow, I could go with a fuse panel that does not have a negative bus bar as part of the panel and then from the electronics go straight to the main (-) bus that will be in the front, wire runs would be the same for the devices seems like this would be a better way to do it.  But I'm not sure.
4. Also for my downriggers I was hoping to install a "Blue Sea 7181 - 30 Amp" on the runs  to the downriggers. Since the power for these would come off the 7725 in the back could I put a 50-100 amp fuse in the 7725 and then put the line so that only the 7181 ever pops..... This seems like a complex solution to a problem that might not be a problem.


This looks good
IMO
Q1
Yes you can add switches(8262) off the 5026 fuse panel or daisy chain off the feed to the 5026 and install a switch with breakers 8372

Q2
Yes the 5026 has a negative bus within the fuse panel

Q3
You can go with a fuse panel with no negative bus....5028
But then you would pull one cable from the rear bus to feed the new front bus 2301

I would recommend you go with the 5025 or 5026  all in one

Q4

My saftey hub has the 30 amp for the downrigger (2 separate fuse one for  each downrigger)
No need to add inline as you are fused at the saftey hub.
FYI blue seas part #s quoted

Dev
Title: Re: Rewire project - help me spend my money
Post by: DevMah on December 05, 2017, 04:39:09 PM
Greg,

I modified the drawing again. I'm not sure what you meant with the ground. If I took it from the negative bus in the back where would it attach to?

As far as in the bow, since the batteries are getting moved forward I can use the negative bus that would be attached to the acr to attach all forward electronics. The run would be the same as if I added an additional bus and I think thats redundant as there would already be on there.

In purple is the change as I think you laid it out.

You could either draw on this where to connect the grounds or say from (-) bus stern connected to (mystery spot?). Also from reading how other boats are grounded I'm not sure if my boat has a ground.

Stick  to the drawing posted at 9:51
Use a wire calculator to figure out you wire sizes

http://circuitwizard.bluesea.com/#


Dev
Title: Re: Rewire project - help me spend my money
Post by: Mr.Petersen on December 05, 2017, 05:06:44 PM
Thanks guys. You have been loads of help. I'm going to look over the diagram #2 and write in wire sizes and stuff and see if more questions arise.
Title: Re: Rewire project - help me spend my money
Post by: GregE on December 05, 2017, 06:32:54 PM
YOu're missing the main $ saving point

Look at the rear wiring pic i posted above  - One each proper sized wire back to front for Pos and Neg anchored on each end by the buss bars.  Smaller wires out ( thru the fuze block ) to the electric systems and back  to the neg buss.

I know there is a diagram posted previously that show this better than i can write it
Title: Re: Rewire project - help me spend my money
Post by: Mr.Petersen on December 14, 2017, 02:01:43 PM
GregE,
I'm looking at my first PDF again. So looking at this I have 2 large positive running to the back, one isolated for motors and one for all other electronics through the battery switch. I understand I could run a large positive to the back and run it to a bus and split from there but then I would never have the batteries and motors isolated and it would negate the reason to have the ACR. Am I missing something?

Parts are about to get ordered.
Title: Re: Rewire project - help me spend my money
Post by: StreamFixer on December 14, 2017, 06:03:01 PM
No disrespect intended  toward GregE and also my dog is carefully chained to the porch.  If there is a difference of opinion on how to proceed, I would keep in mind, DevMah does electrical work for a living...  Since I have not studied either of the recommendations, I have no opinion.

StreamFixer
Title: Re: Rewire project - help me spend my money
Post by: DevMah on December 16, 2017, 01:58:41 PM
No disrespect intended  toward GregE and also my dog is carefully chained to the porch.  If there is a difference of opinion on how to proceed, I would keep in mind, DevMah does electrical work for a living...  Since I have not studied either of the recommendations, I have no opinion.

StreamFixer

Lol....

I believe Greg is say the same thing as I....
Run one large B+(positive cable) and one large B- ((negative cable) Greg is referring it as the ground)
So that you only have one run of two cables going from the rear to the front. As you can see he has two large bus bars In  the rear (B+ and B-) with two lines feeding the front.... less cables less $$$ spent.

Post reply #1 has it drawn this way.

Dev


Steam fixer your dog can stand down now it’s get pretty cold at night on the porch...lol